Episode 5

The Complicated Story of Soul Food

Down Home Cooking, also known as Soul Food, is African American cuisine stemming from the days of enslavement, and spread throughout the country through the Great Migration. This episode will explore the history of soul food, before talking to current chefs who will share their individual experiences with soul food, why it is controversial to some Black chefs, and whether it is appropriation when white Southern chefs cook and profit off of dishes popularized and created by Black cooks and chefs hundreds of years ago.

In this episode, Deb talks to:

• Thérèse Nelson, who is a chef, author, and founder of Black Culinary History

• Chef Chris Scott, owner of Butterfunk Biscuit

• Mashama Bailey, chef and co-owner of The Grey

Episode highlights:

What is Soul Food?

• Thérèse cites Lolis Eric Elie, whose definition of soul food is that it is the food of people descended from the African diaspora, a collection of ingredients and techniques that tell a similar story. Thérèse thinks the proper term to use is Black food, rather than soul food. “Soul food,” as a term, is not representative of the whole story, she says. Rather, it’s a good entry point to discussing Black food more broadly.

• She also explains Vertemae Grosvenor’s thoughts about soul food as a particular translation of Black culture that existed in a particular time of migration and forward movement and thinking. It was less about particular dishes, she says, and more about a new way of thinking about Blackness.

• The term was coined during the 1960s during the civil rights movement, Deb points out, to represent heritage cuisines that were preserved during the Great Migration.

The Regionality of Soul Food

• Both Thérèse and Chris talk about the regionality of soul food. Chris outlines some of these regional differences, from Lowcountry and Creole influences to foods of the Florida Panhandle, Texas, and the Virginia Tidewater. In the west, he says, there are more barbecue influences; in the north, there are more ingredients like sugar, cream, and butter.

• “When you look at the regions of southern cuisine, that tells a story,” he says.

Exploring the Possibilities of Soul Food

• Chris talks about ways to push Black food forward by experimenting with recipes to tweak, expand, and elevate soul food. Still rooted in culture, he says, it can move onward and upward as a modern cuisine.

• He advocates for staging at Black restaurants as one method. While most chefs consider staging, or training, at major restaurants like Per Se, he wants to see chefs taking interest in Black food and knowing how to use ingredients like ham hocks, Haitian pickles, chow chows, and collard greens.

• People of all races staging in Black restaurants would lead to branching out and more change in the ways that soul food is presented, he says. It would expand the possibilities of what soul food could look like.

Pushing the Boundaries of What Soul Food Can Mean

• Thérèse, Chris, and Mashama all agree on the notion of pushing the boundaries of soul food and elevating perspectives of food in general. Mashama talks about how, at The Grey, she didn’t want to be defined by people’s expectations and what they thought she should be cooking. 

• She resisted including a lot of traditional soul food dishes, like fried chicken, on the menu at first, particularly as she became comfortable with her own voice and cooking style, which was rooted in European and Asian influences. 

• Mashama doesn’t think that soul food defines Blackness; she believes that there was a time and a place for it and that it was a way of showing love.

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